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On 5/22/2020 at 11:46 AM, Plattym3 said:

Then, understandable. But localization doesn't always mean just translation. I'm completely in favor of everyone just being Joe, Frank, Molly, and Jane in DQ games

I'm not claiming localization is just translation. But I'll defend any official attempt to bring multiple languages in line with each other. It makes it easier to discuss internationally. Plus, translators who focus on sticking to the source material are less likely to needlessly censor things. I'm not asking for nudity, but really, how is "what the hell" any worse than "what in Nadiria"? One is how people actually talk in the real world, so you better get used to it, and the other is censorship. Or heck, even the concept of a god vs a goddess. In a series where God is canonically male and already had been revealed to be so before they started using the new localization style?

 

I'm sure I've said this before, but I just love the way Dragon Warrior VII's script was written.  It's got a couple typographical, spelling, and grammar errors, but for all its faults it still comes out as professional product to be taken seriously as well as fun game with a genuinely interesting high-stakes adventure story. While to some extent I've come to adore the modern DQ localization style (DQ8 and DQ11 are the best examples, I still demand they redo IX, its localization was horrible to read - but X is much more important), Dragon Warrior VII's lack of constant puns (and its somewhat more literal translation style) allow the script to focus more on the plot. The darker and more serious elements of the story, when played straight like this, give the game a tone I just really, really, love. It's like reading an amazing book. Whether or not it was Mr. Horii's intention, the original localization we got for DWVII tells a story with a deep-rooted message about god, religion, humanity, and our role in the world as people. What that message is, I'll let you decide for yourself. As with all art, what you get out of it is subjective. But I could see people hundreds of years from now studying it like the works of Homer and other great storytellers of the past. Dragon Warrior VII is the only video game that has ever given me this kind of impression. This is the reason I really got into Dragon Quest, but to this day I'm still hungry for more of that. Not even it's remake comes close.

 

Anyway, the whole reason I brought up DWVII is to point out another thing I love about it's localization: they had totally normal english names, like Kiefer, Maribel, Hank, Patrick, and Matilda, to name a few, right next to definitely-foreign names like Soto, Flower, Gabo, Aira, Swift, or Hadid. But they didn't feel the need to cheese up the foreign characters' dialogue for the sake of, I dunno, "variety", I guess? Everybody just talks like people.

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3 hours ago, Erdrick The Hero said:

how is "what the hell" any worse than "what in Nadiria"? One is how people actually talk in the real world, so you better get used to it, and the other is censorship. Or heck, even the concept of a god vs a goddess. In a series where God is canonically male and already had been revealed to be so before they started using the new localization style?

I may have missed that one since I play in French, but I don't see any problem with that. 

Sure Dragon Quest games have been censored every now and then (the crosses in churches for examples), but in this particular example, I for one don't se what is wrong. As Nadiria is basically Hell in the DQ universe, it makes sense that they would say "What in Nadiria" instead of "What the Hell". Just like I'd find it logical to see, let's say, Kratos say "What in Hades", or Thor say "What the Hel". or something like that.

As for God becoming a Goddess... I guess that depends of the games. In DQ I to III, Rubiss has been established as being a female Goddess even in Japan fro quite some time now (ie: the novels/manga Seirei Rubiss Densetsu). Rubiss being in DQVI, and considering that IV and V follow this game, it also seems logical at least to me, that townfolks would say Goddess instead of God.

However, if you're talking about VII or IX, the main deity being a male (Numen and Zenus), I don't actually remember seeing people talking about Goddesses in particular. I do remember the All-Mighty (Tout-Puissant in my game) in both games. 

As for other example, Radatom, the castle of DQ1, being translated as Tantegel is another good idea imo, as it evoks Arthurian myths etc. I can't really complain about any of the translation we've had really, be it in English, or in French.

...Wait, actually I can. The Adventure of Daï manga kept the japanese name for spells (Mera, Iora, Merazoma, Behoimi...) which is a pain as it doesn't mean anything to one that has only played the games. Just like Emblem of Roto decided to keep most of the japanese name for towns and people (ie, Roto instead of Elric), whereas EoR uses the french spell names (Crame, Megacrame, Soins Partiels for example). 

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9 hours ago, Erdrick The Hero said:

[...] What that message is, I'll let you decide for yourself. As with all art, what you get out of it is subjective. But I could see people hundreds of years from now studying it like the works of Homer and other great storytellers of the past.

You mean the deistic view of God and that religion is bad?

I disagree with him, but hey, I love the game. =P

Edit: Actually, giving it a second thought, it's not so much deistic because God does same humanity in a way... well it's ambiguous to me if the whole birth of the Hero was just the Spiritis doing or God had a role in it. It's been years since a played it. I never got around finishing it on the 3DS, I should.


By the way, not a fan of the puns as wells, and I prefer the localization being closer to the original. But sometimes the localized name are better indeed.

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The Nadiria thing wouldn't bother me so much if it were consistent. If canonically, hell WAS Nadiria. But some of the games are censored and some aren't, and it makes the censorship blatantly obvious.

 

I've always been of the mind that Rubiss and God are two separate, but not mutually exclusive entities. The worlds of Dragon Quest, in my eyes, aren't monotheistic, but God would be the "Zeus" figure, essentially God of the Gods. Even just within DQ7, the four Spirits are essentially gods in and of themselves, just not as powerful as "the" God.

 

The reason censorship bothers me so much (beyond the principal of the thing) is that it often makes canonical details conflict with each other that weren't even a problem in the source material. Especially when trying to piece together lore from multiple games with multiple ratings. For example, without censoring "God" in every game, it would be implied that the God we see in DQ7 is very likely the same one worshipped in the earlier games. But changing all references of God to Godess means suddenly in the English versions of the games, there's a brand new deity that doesn't even exist in the source material. I guess it could imply Rubiss, but that wouldn't be true of the source material.

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On 6/11/2020 at 8:19 PM, Erdrick The Hero said:

The worlds of Dragon Quest, in my eyes, aren't monotheistic

Some literary works as early as 1993, and considered canon by Horii did explain a bit of the myth and pantheon of the DQ universe. Mainly in Seirei Rubiss Densetsu. 

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On 6/13/2020 at 4:10 PM, Xiggy said:

Some literary works as early as 1993, and considered canon by Horii did explain a bit of the myth and pantheon of the DQ universe. Mainly in Seirei Rubiss Densetsu. 

Do fan translations exist?

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2 hours ago, DragonQuest2IsGood said:

Do fan translations exist?

Sadly no. However there is a Japanese Wikipedia page and a Japanese DQ wikia that do hold some interesting stuff about both the books and its Manga adaptation. 

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