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AustNerevar

Orchestral Mod Copyright Notice

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Just thought I'd give a heads up to amyone who might be seeding or downloading the orchestral overhaul mod...I actually got a copyright notice from Charter. Apparently I got it last month but I just now noticed it. I was a little stunned that I would get a notice for this. Its ridiculous.c317665f5f609cc1a85bdeb014e28cf7.jpg

 

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Why would Charter send you a copyright notice?

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Sugiyama attacks! Sugiyama, Charter, and company cast Copyright Catastrophe!

Edited by YangustheLegendaryBandit

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Nothing a good VPN can't fix.

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Why would Charter send you a copyright notice?
Because Charter is my ISP.

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Nothing a good VPN can't fix.
Yeah, I've been planning on doing that for my own internet safety anyway.

Still thought it prudent to make people aware in case they wanted to download this mod.

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1 hour ago, AustNerevar said:

Because Charter is my ISP.

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Yeah, I've been planning on doing that for my own internet safety anyway.

Still thought it prudent to make people aware in case they wanted to download this mod.

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But since when do ISP’s issue copyright notices?

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Are you f**king kidding me?

 

Now my one hobby is under attack from all fronts. I'm getting real sick of existence. At least I've already got the mod... I should back up my game EXE in case SE issues a takedown and then patch the game.

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28 minutes ago, eal said:

But since when do ISP’s issue copyright notices?

They didn't issue it they have to pass any DMCA notices on to the customer.

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I'm hoping this goes to court.  This goes above and beyond the bounds of international copyright laws.  They're fully legal to mod for.

It's unlikely SE filed this, but someone working for Sugiyama keeping track of the game releases, and noticed the mod.  It's an easy win in court, but could be an extended legal battle, so if it came down to it, it would be asking for a lot, and it could tarnish Dragon Quest's name, but likely only in light of Sugiyama himself.  Though I think most likely just Sugiyama's brand name would be tarnished.   I don't think it will, but this should go forward.  This crosses the line of acceptability and control, especially when the mod itself contains no copyright material.

If SE had filed, it would be a direct cease and desist from them, and likely one sent directly to steam.  It's probably why Steam hasn't removed it, as I'm sure they were sent a C&D, and likely know full well mods are 100% legit so long as no copyright material is present within them, and any lawsuit could be counter sued for libel and damages.

I am PRAYING that Koichi Sugiyama disappears from the scene with some dignity soon, and gives his chosen heir the right to pick how he/she wants the music represented in games going forward.  He is a videogame player, so maybe he should just focus on that, live out his last years in fun and leave the world alone.

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I'm hoping this goes to court.  This goes above and beyond the bounds of international copyright laws.  They're fully legal to mod for.
It's unlikely SE filed this, but someone working for Sugiyama keeping track of the game releases, and noticed the mod.  It's an easy win in court, but could be an extended legal battle, so if it came down to it, it would be asking for a lot, and it could tarnish Dragon Quest's name, but likely only in light of Sugiyama himself.  Though I think most likely just Sugiyama's brand name would be tarnished.   I don't think it will, but this should go forward.  This crosses the line of acceptability and control, especially when the mod itself contains no copyright material.
If SE had filed, it would be a direct cease and desist from them, and likely one sent directly to steam.  It's probably why Steam hasn't removed it, as I'm sure they were sent a C&D, and likely know full well mods are 100% legit so long as no copyright material is present within them, and any lawsuit could be counter sued for libel and damages.
I am PRAYING that Koichi Sugiyama disappears from the scene with some dignity soon, and gives his chosen heir the right to pick how he/she wants the music represented in games going forward.  He is a videogame player, so maybe he should just focus on that, live out his last years in fun and leave the world alone.
The mod most definitely contains copyrighted material. The entirety of the orchestral score is included and orchestral pieces from previous games.

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9 minutes ago, AustNerevar said:

The mod most definitely contains copyrighted material. The entirety of the orchestral score is included and orchestral pieces from previous games.

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Oh, I see.  Then it's valid.  I thought the mod was separate and you were supposed to download the tracks yourself.

Still sucks, it's not like it isn't the best way to play the game.  Offers the best experience or anything, and it isn't like 90% of us wouldn't buy the CD or anything, or that it can be used outside the bounds of the mod can it?

Edited by ignasia

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Oh, I see.  Then it's valid.  I thought the mod was separate and you were supposed to download the tracks yourself.
Still sucks, it's not like it isn't the best way to play the game.  Offers the best experience or anything, and it isn't like 90% of us wouldn't buy the CD or anything, or that it can be used outside the bounds of the mod can it?
None of the tracks can be removed from the mod or listened to outside of the game. The mod authors encrypted it to encourage people to buy the orchestral suites if they wanted the actual track. But the files are technically all there, including the remuxed animated FMV sequences that are in the game so the mod is quite large as a result.

Its just so bizarre that they are even going after it. If you're wanting to obtain Sugiyama's work without paying for it, this mod is not the most ideal method of doing so. And further, its not like its super popular or anything. DQ is niche to begin with, especially so on PC. And there weren't a TON of people seeding or downloading the mod anyway.

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14 hours ago, AustNerevar said:

None of the tracks can be removed from the mod or listened to outside of the game. The mod authors encrypted it to encourage people to buy the orchestral suites if they wanted the actual track. But the files are technically all there, including the remuxed animated FMV sequences that are in the game so the mod is quite large as a result.

Its just so bizarre that they are even going after it. If you're wanting to obtain Sugiyama's work without paying for it, this mod is not the most ideal method of doing so. And further, its not like its super popular or anything. DQ is niche to begin with, especially so on PC. And there weren't a TON of people seeding or downloading the mod anyway.

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I hesitate to believe it, but I'm finding evidence every day that DQ is no longer a niche. It's like overnight it went from unheard of to everyone knows of it's existence even if they don't play it.

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16 minutes ago, Erdrick The Hero said:

I hesitate to believe it, but I'm finding evidence every day that DQ is no longer a niche. It's like overnight it went from unheard of to everyone knows of it's existence even if they don't play it.

That bodes very well for the Switch version.

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I don't like the idea of orchestral mods since I like the regular soundtrack, but this is a bit surreal. Mods are a positive force in gaming, making people find the tweaks to get their perfect experience and such. I hope SE would understand.

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2 hours ago, wiregu said:

I don't like the idea of orchestral mods since I like the regular soundtrack, but this is a bit surreal. Mods are a positive force in gaming, making people find the tweaks to get their perfect experience and such. I hope SE would understand.

I can promise you that this has NOTHING to do with SE.  If it were, then SE itself would be the one doing the issuing, not the Intellectual Property Enforcement Entertainment Software Association.  Like they always do.  If Square-Enix themselves requested Steam remove the mod, or were behind this, Steam might actually have forcibly removed it and made it clear no links could be present on the steam forums for this game as they will no longer support it.

It's still on the steam forum.

So this is almost definitely the Sugiyama Kobo label.  Especially given it is ONLY this mod that is targeted.  I doubt it's Sugiyama himself, but at his blessing, and someone who works for him who does this sort of thing, or a lawyer group, or a group associated with his label he uses as an intermediary enforcement who files with the right agencies in any country they find any infringement on his copyright.  It could even be an associated group tied to the artist property rights group he belongs to.

SE and by definition, Yuji Horii, seem not to care for the modding community (or for that matter the translation and modding community for the DQ series in general), unless it's about a translation for a game they plan to release.  That's the only time they ever go after anyone for DQ.  For other series there are other reasons, like the Chrono Trigger communities that seek to expand the games through their own spin-offs or enhance the original game with an HD or at least upgraded remake.  They don't care about modding the original build though, only when it comes to certain types of mods that would be like a whole separate game or total overhaul.  They seem to only want those under their belt.

Like if someone made a patch for DQ7 3DS, or DQ8 3DS, I don't doubt for a second that SE would ignore it entirely, let it proceed.  Nintendo as well, though Nintendo is more likely to pursue the modding community (and emulation for that matter).  SE might see it as a lost cause...a money pit essentially that could ruin them, both financially in courts because the laws would favour players in most modding cases, and through sales losses due to bad press (which almost happened, and is why Yoichi Wada was literally forced out of his position after two former Enix Chairs openly complained about the mismanagement of the two companies since the merger and how neither has made any money, when they should have been raking it in...and one openly discussed the negative press and player feedback in Japan, but surprisingly mentioned the West).  Or SE might see it as non-harmful.  Most mods and translations are for games they haven't even released yet...which is foolish as they could work with translation communities to buy up translations and tweak them a bit to fit how they want them to look, then release on the newest iteration of VC or Classics, whatever.  They haven't.  Then there's the possibility SE just doesn't care because sales for new IPs and remakes are in ball-park ranges to suggest there's no need...or maybe it's the nature that certain mods do increase availability and thus spread their name and the name of their IP's for potential new customers (least likely take for them).

This is definitely NOT SE though.  We'd have seen direct shutdowns and requests of the modders themselves to close things down, not going after those who downloaded...on top of Steam and requesting Steam to shut it down.  Given their tactics, it would have been a very curt but respectful C&D, and one they know would have been made VERY public.

Edited by ignasia

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10 minutes ago, ignasia said:

I can promise you that this has NOTHING to do with SE.  If it were, then SE itself would be the one doing the issuing, not the Intellectual Property Enforcement Entertainment Software Association.  Like they always do.  If Square-Enix themselves requested Steam remove the mod, or were behind this, Steam might actually have forcibly removed it and made it clear no links could be present on the steam forums for this game as they will no longer support it.

It's still on the steam forum.

So this is almost definitely the Sugiyama Kobo label.  Especially given it is ONLY this mod that is targeted.  I doubt it's Sugiyama himself, but at his blessing, and someone who works for him who does this sort of thing, or a lawyer group, or a group associated with his label he uses as an intermediary enforcement who files with the right agencies in any country they find any infringement on his copyright.  It could even be an associated group tied to the artist property rights group he belongs to.

SE and by definition, Yuji Horii, seem not to care for the modding community (or for that matter the translation and modding community for the DQ series in general), unless it's about a translation for a game they plan to release.  That's the only time they ever go after anyone for DQ.  For other series there are other reasons, like the Chrono Trigger communities that seek to expand the games through their own spin-offs or enhance the original game with an HD or at least upgraded remake.  They don't care about modding the original build though, only when it comes to certain types of mods that would be like a whole separate game or total overhaul.  They seem to only want those under their belt.

Like if someone made a patch for DQ7 3DS, or DQ8 3DS, I don't doubt for a second that SE would ignore it entirely, let it proceed.  Nintendo as well, though Nintendo is more likely to pursue the modding community (and emulation for that matter).  SE might see it as a lost cause...a money pit essentially that could ruin them, both financially in courts because the laws would favour players in most modding cases, and through sales losses due to bad press (which almost happened, and is why Yoichi Wada was literally forced out of his position after two former Enix Chairs openly complained about the mismanagement of the two companies since the merger and how neither has made any money, when they should have been raking it in...and one openly discussed the negative press and player feedback in Japan, but surprisingly mentioned the West).  Or SE might see it as non-harmful.  Most mods and translations are for games they haven't even released yet...which is foolish as they could work with translation communities to buy up translations and tweak them a bit to fit how they want them to look, then release on the newest iteration of VC or Classics, whatever.  They haven't.  Then there's the possibility SE just doesn't care because sales for new IPs and remakes are in ball-park ranges to suggest there's no need...or maybe it's the nature that certain mods do increase availability and thus spread their name and the name of their IP's for potential new customers (least likely take for them).

This is definitely NOT SE though.  We'd have seen direct shutdowns and requests of the modders themselves to close things down, not going after those who downloaded...on top of Steam and requesting Steam to shut it down.  Given their tactics, it would have been a very curt but respectful C&D, and one they know would have been made VERY public.

It’s totally because of Sugiyama Kobo for sure. With how protective he is about his music, it’s not all that surprising the old man found out about the mod and is trying to get it shut down somehow. Honestly it’s amazing the mod has even been around for as long as it had. I figured once the mod was announced and released he and anyone working for him would have done ANYTHING to shut the orchestral mod down.

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Sounds like you used BitTorrent to download the mod. I got a message from my ISP about illegal download of DQ11 when I tried to download DQ11 using BitTorrent (I didn't fully download it due to lack of space on my hard drive at the time, and deleted the incomplete file before I even got the notice). BitTorrent is being tracked by IP holders. There is encrypted BitTorrent, but not all torrent downloaders support encryption. With encrypted torrents, the IP holder has to download the file in question themselves to figure out what it is. Of course, if they do that, they can easily snag the IPs of everyone downloading said file. I would recommend not using BitTorrent to download files. Unless you use a VPN that doesn't log your activity.

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Sounds like you used BitTorrent to download the mod. I got a message from my ISP about illegal download of DQ11 when I tried to download DQ11 using BitTorrent (I didn't fully download it due to lack of space on my hard drive at the time, and deleted the incomplete file before I even got the notice). BitTorrent is being tracked by IP holders. There is encrypted BitTorrent, but not all torrent downloaders support encryption. With encrypted torrents, the IP holder has to download the file in question themselves to figure out what it is. Of course, if they do that, they can easily snag the IPs of everyone downloading said file. I would recommend not using BitTorrent to download files. Unless you use a VPN that doesn't log your activity.
Well I primarily download legal stuff with BitTorrent. Its not just for piracy you know.

I didn't expect them to care about a mod for DQ.

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Well I primarily download legal stuff with BitTorrent. Its not just for piracy you know.



100% didn't know that.

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17 minutes ago, Plattym3 said:

100% didn't know that.

 

Oh yeah, it's a great way to transfer files, especially in business.  Or let's say you've made a bunch of family videos you want to transfer to a family member, or maybe some company that is going to splice them together for a collage or montage of some sort.  It's a great way to transfer with limited loss or corruption, given it splits everything into smaller bytes and checks the consistency and authenticity of each small byte/packet as it's completed, then drops any inaccurate pieces and redownloads them again.

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A lot of artists release albums for free over torrent. Any large download works great over torrent really. The primary way that different distributions of Linux OS got passed around was through torrent.

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