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Reddragon18

Probably going to stop.

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it’s so weird how fast my mind can change, but it did. Playing Pathfinder Kingmaker recently and investigating JRPGs, I’m not really that interested in them. It’s odd the more I started to research JRPGs the more I dislike them (Story, characters, lack of party creation, artstyle, setting, etc.) And I cant bring myself to play even 1 more. DQ is kind of boring to me now, 11 personally disappointed me and I only beat the first 2 acts and I was done. Monsters for the GBC is fun but isn’t enough. I’ve been playing card games like mage wars and probably going to order D&D soon as the more I see of it I just want to get my hands on it (Other WRPGs in general.). I originally started with the JRPG such as Pokémon and well DQ, a couple others. But I’m tired of that stuff now I want more games that offer more and I love classic western fantasy more than anything. Right now I’m in 11th grade almost done and I’m planning on going into the military after HS, so I’m moving on though I would have never gotten into the “RPG” genre without DQ which I thank for that. Going to start selling all my DQ games and others (I have a lot.). Not going to be active on this forum anymore either though it has been fun!

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Well that's unfortunate.  There's enough room in my life for tabletop and computer role playing games.  You could very well play DQIII and "roleplay" given the way the game is set up.  I'd say DQIII and DQIX are the closest a video game will ever get to being like D&D especially IX with its social elements.  So... mind telling us which games you're selling? ;)

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I’m selling all my games together for 45% cheaper than I bought them for here’s my lists (All physical cartridges no manuals or boxes.)

3 for the GBC.

Dragon Warrior Monsters 1&2 GBC

Dragon Warrior NES

Dragon Warrior 2 NES

Dragon Warrior 4 NES

5, 6, 9 for the DS.

Thats all I got!

(3 and 9 are only related in party creation and nothing else unfortunately.)

 

Edited by Reddragon18
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I can’t imagine going cold turkey on a series I enjoyed. Seems drastic.

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Just now, YangustheLegendaryBandit said:

I can’t imagine going cold turkey on a series I enjoyed. Seems drastic.

That’s what I thought for a long while, and who knows if 12 ever comes out maybe I’ll get it who knows. But I want something more that these games can’t offer. My mind has changed much over the past 2 years and I will continue changing and growing in different ways.

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18 minutes ago, YangustheLegendaryBandit said:

I can’t imagine going cold turkey on a series I enjoyed. Seems drastic.

For whatever reason, I feel like whenever people stop posting here they also don’t play Dragon Quest games anymore. Like someone who might have posted here for, say, 4 years and then suddenly disappeared have also given up on Dragon Quest in general. Or I at least wonder if x person still plays Dragon Quest games.

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There’s a lot of people I’ve seen on here who haven’t posted in more than 4 years I think many have gone, but I could be wrong cause I haven’t been here that long.

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34 minutes ago, Reddragon18 said:

That’s what I thought for a long while, and who knows if 12 ever comes out maybe I’ll get it who knows. But I want something more that these games can’t offer. My mind has changed much over the past 2 years and I will continue changing and growing in different ways.

Sometimes I think overload can do that to you.  Also depends on what JRPG games you picked.  Some have a lot of Western influence in different ways:

Xenoblade Chronicles 1, X, or 2
Etrian Odyssey
Shin Megami Tensei (actually I'd say Atlus in general borrows heavily from Western games even today).

Though it's all based on preferences.

Personally I don't like Western RPGs as much these days.  I find them to be hollow shells of what they used to be, with a handful of exceptions (bare handful).  Most of what used to be real choices are now pretend choices steered down narrow hallways towards skinner box rewards.  It's not just Bethesda either, but even Bioware has taken more and more influence from skinner-box design.

Try playing Fallout 1 and 2, then New Vegas, then go to 3 and finally 4.  Then Elder Scrolls from Daggerfall through Skyrim.  Watch the directional changes and reductionist approach with each game, especially after Oblivion.  1, 2, and NV really feel alive and 3 and 4 feel like dead worlds with carbon cutout NPCs you're either forced to help or forced to kill, no matter how many choice options are offered, the game always picks which path you'll take, as it doesn't allow for any other choices (like Fallout 3's beginning is impossible without killing half if not all the other vault members, no matter what you do).

I have yet to find a game like KOTOR in terms of real dynamics in character development.  That game is legend.  KOTOR 2 is a bit of a step backwards.

While we're at it, one funny Japanese influence on Western RPG's is FF12 heavily influenced Dragon Age origins and 2.  Inquisition dumps on DA and while DA 1 and 2 are part of Bioware's shift since Neverwinter Nights 2 of giving a false impression of choice, but really steering the player down a funnel of same outcomes, there is a bit of range in options and outcomes, and the first two do a far better job (like Neverwinter Nights 2) of masking this funneling element.  You feel like you have choices and there are real outcome alternatives.  Inquisition does not.  It's so blatantly fixed in directly and forced character progression it's even less open than most standard JRPG's.  It actually makes Bethesda's dumping on what made Fallout 1 and 2, as they never understood actual character development (actual RPing).

Then again few studios really grasped true RPing and attempting to make a real DnD or Whitewolf game in a videogame experience quite like Interplay did.  Some did get it, like Sierra was great.

Witcher 3 isn't bad, it's actually a decent game, though there are points with lots of empty space, but not quite FF15 level...voids of nothingness.  Better character development as well.

If you want a good transitional game that doesn't just borrow, but is a Japanese take on Western RPG's, and yet with more story focus: Dragon's Dogma.

If you've never played any of the Soulsbourne then I do suggest it.  It's another Japanese game system heavily influenced by Western RPG's (and Dragon Quest for that matter...well that's the only specific game series mentioned as an influence, but clearly it borrows from a plethora of Western RPG's).

 

If you ever get a chance to...look into System Shock.  ESPECIALLY the second game.  The original build is nothing short of amazing.  It has mystery, adventure, rpg, and shooter elements.  Lots of crazy story bits, lots of psychological elements thrown in...it's really layered.

 

In anycase, after you've taken some time off, consider asking about JRPG's that you might want to get into.  There are a surprising number of series that you would probably be able to get into.  Also a break does the mind good.  You might find you miss some elements in JRPG's that aren't inherent in WRPG's, especially given complexity is different.  JRPG's tend to be more layered in terms of stacking elements, while WRPG's tend to be more layered in terms of preparation and foreknowledge.

 

OH...If you haven't, maybe you have, but look into Divinity 2.  It borrows heavily from Bioware's best days.  Heavily.  Baldur's Gate (especially 2), Neverwinter Nights (some say 2, I say 1), Dragon Age 1 and 2 (I'm not sure which I prefer), and Icewind Dale.

 

OH right, three last game name drops:

Arcanum: Of Steamworks and Magic Obscura
Beyond Good and Evil
Anachronox
 

15 minutes ago, eal said:

For whatever reason, I feel like whenever people stop posting here they also don’t play Dragon Quest games anymore. Like someone who might have posted here for, say, 4 years and then suddenly disappeared have also given up on Dragon Quest in general. Or I at least wonder if x person still plays Dragon Quest games.

Except some of them do come back, and usually are still playing, just busy with life, or stopped posting.  This site isn't exactly a good gauge on the DQ community.

Edited by ignasia

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40 minutes ago, YangustheLegendaryBandit said:

I can’t imagine going cold turkey on a series I enjoyed. Seems drastic.

I don't think I'll ever stop being a DQ fan lol.  This game is my LIFE.

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Tastes change over time, you could just be growing up.

Some JRPG's I just don't like due to the style. Very MOE looking rpgs I can't get into.

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I’m planning on playing TES 1-5, BG 1&2, KOTOR, Fallout 1-2 +New Vegas, Planetscape Torment, A Bards take (C64), Wizadry, ultima, Temple of Elemental Evil, Advanced dungeons and dragons (C64/GoldBox Games), Pathfinder Kingmaker (Currently playing not even close to finishing), Might and Magic, Tabletop D&D Starting kit (Will add one more later once I expierence the basics, More card games in general just got Mage wars arena and I’m loving it. There’s a lot more RPGs to play definitely but I won’t play SMT as I don’t like it’s setting and focus on teenagers, and I’ve played dark souls already, Etrian Odyssey' (5) Art-style really put me off and the UI. And I’ll try out SystemShock I’ve heard good things.

Edited by Reddragon18
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This is a fascinating read. Thanks for participating the past year. Enjoy the new bevy of genres and games.

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1 hour ago, Sackchief said:

I don't think I'll ever stop being a DQ fan lol.  This game is my LIFE.

Yeah, I’d have to echo this. While I didn’t play a main series game until 2010 since I wasn’t really in the know about Dragon Warrior returning to the Dragon Quest name, I consider myself a longtime fan since I first played Dragon Warrior Monsters on my GBC. It and both versions of Monsters 2 were the only games related to the series I had for along time and I loved most everything about those games (especially 2), but I felt right at home when I finally started playing the main series with III (GBC version) and IV (DS version).

I felt kind of dense since it took me so long to finally play a main series game/learn about the name change, but I’m glad I did start playing many more games from the series the past 9 years, have enjoyed many great DQ experiences old, new, and imported and found this wonderful website/forum/group of DQ fans.

Edited by YangustheLegendaryBandit
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Yeah, I’d have to echo this. While I didn’t play a main series game until 2010 since I wasn’t really in the know about Dragon Warrior returning to the Dragon Quest name, I consider myself a longtime fan since I first played Dragon Warrior Monsters on my GBC. It and both versions of Monsters 2 were the only games related to the series I had for along time and I loved most everything about those games (especially 2), but I felt right at home when I finally started playing the main series with III (GBC version) and IV (DS version).

I felt kind of dense since it took me so long to finally play a main series game/learn about the name change, but I’m glad I did start playing many more games from the series the past 9 years, have enjoyed many great DQ experiences old, new, and imported and found this wonderful website/forum/group of DQ fans.

Nice story. I think along with the fact that DQV and DQVI missed out on localizations during the most important time for JRPGs, the name change to Dragon Warrior is a cause of a lot of the series misfortune in the West. I know many retro games fans who are nostalgic about DW and have no idea it became DQ.

 

My first DQ game was VIII when I got the demo from Shonen Jump and I immediately fell in love with the massively detailed and immersive game worlds and the rest was history. The online DQ community is awesome. It’s such a small niche community, I see familiar faces all across social media. DQ is absolutely a game series I am proud to call my favorite.

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@Reddragon18 Good luck in your future endeavors :):thumbsup:

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When I first started playing DQ, your Website, and KingZenith’s guides were amazing. I never thought before a website like this existed for such a small series. I hope more people join this forum (Cause I think it’s better than all the others.).

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44 minutes ago, Reddragon18 said:

When I first started playing DQ, your Website, and KingZenith’s guides were amazing. I never thought before a website like this existed for such a small series. I hope more people join this forum (Cause I think it’s better than all the others.).

Thank you for the compliments, all the information that people have provided me over the years is what really helps this site out. :)

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When I first started playing DQ, your Website, and KingZenith’s guides were amazing. I never thought before a website like this existed for such a HUGE series. I hope more people join this forum (Cause I think it’s better than all the others.).


Fixed that a bit for you. I mean, even considering just English releases, there are dozens.
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6 hours ago, Plattym3 said:


 

 


Fixed that a bit for you. I mean, even considering just English releases, there are dozens.

Quite so, and even though the first installment sold so poorly it had to be given away with Nintendo Power, that only makes it's success greater.  IT was a humbling misstep, but it was a small start to a big series.  A series present on several systems since the NES in several genres. "Sic Parvis Magnum".

Sad to see a fan leave the series behind, RedDragon, but everyone's got to go their own way.   Happy trails, if you go through with the departure.

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55 minutes ago, The Dog of Zahan said:

Quite so, and even though the first installment sold so poorly it had to be given away with Nintendo Power, that only makes it's success greater.  IT was a humbling misstep, but it was a small start to a big series.  A series present on several systems since the NES in several genres. "Sic Parvis Magnum".

Sad to see a fan leave the series behind, RedDragon, but everyone's got to go their own way.   Happy trails, if you go through with the departure.

...

The first installment sold 500k copies.  It never sold poorly, that was strictly rumour.  That wasn't why they gave it away.  They gave the game away because Nintendo really felt that due to the enormous success of Dragon Quest III, which had already released in Japan, they could potentially emulate it.

Dragon Warrior released in August of 1989 in the US

Dragon Quest III released in February of 1988 in Japan <- so they already knew Dragon Quest was a hot item, and Howard Lincoln talked openly about wanting to see success and believing in both Dragon Quest and Final Fantasy as brands within the US...which is why both were pushed so hard through Nintendo Power.

Actual giveaway + sales is anywhere from 1.5m to well over 1.5m depending on how you want to read into NP's own article discussing the giveaway, which incidentally was their largest growth period for subscriptions ever:

https://www.pressthebuttons.com/2014/08/how-did-nintendo-handle-the-great-dragon-warrior-giveaway.html

The way they talk about it suggests millions were given away.

This was based on a former Dragon Warrior fanbase that tracked actual sales numbers:

https://web.archive.org/web/20071021081552/www.planetnintendo.com/alefgard/dqhistory.asp

Sadly DQNN doesn't exist anymore, and there's no archive in the database I've been able to find to show original post and source links, but I will vouch for its authenticity, but here...

https://www.usgamer.net/articles/the-new-dark-age-of-dragon-quest

Quote

Sure, Dragon Warrior was a modest success in the U.S.; historical sales reports peg it at about half a million units units.

For a NES game...that's not modest.  That is phenomenal.  Though it's REALLY hard today to find good sales data and original source material on NES era sales, but commonly 250k was considered a resounding success, like numbers that literally built companies in the late 80's.  Even in the SNES era 500k would be considered astoundingly high.

FF4 sold only about 340k in the US, and FF6 only about 450k (yeah I was shocked to learn that was the real number).

http://vgsales.wikia.com/wiki/Final_Fantasy

----

Until Persona 5, none of the Persona games, not even 4, hit 500k outside Japan.  Not just America, but everywhere outside Japan.

Tales?  350k is considered very successful for Bandai Namco.  150~250k is fairly typical, and their higher selling games go into the 300~400k units, but it's rare.  Yet Namco classifies 250k as a success story.

So you get the point.  Sorry, as I usually do, I'm hammering it home pretty hard...making sure that nail doesn't pop up again.

Edited by ignasia
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Yeah, Dragon Warrior is the very definition of a cult classic video game, if that's a thing.  The biggest problem is that Nintendo saw DQIII selling like a million copies in one day and thought they could replicate that, so the supply far outweighed the demand.  DWI is one of the most common NES games on the retro gaming market, you could build a house out of all the DWI carts in the country.  If you guys want to read more about DWI's launch, I'd recommend checking out this book called "Power-Up: How Japanese Games Gave the World an Extra Life".  Its written by one of the better guys over at Kotaku, its well researched.

 

Also those are cool artchives ignasia.  I haven't seen those sites before.

Edited by Sackchief
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7 hours ago, ignasia said:

...

The first installment sold 500k copies.  It never sold poorly, that was strictly rumour.  That wasn't why they gave it away.  They gave the game away because Nintendo really felt that due to the enormous success of Dragon Quest III, which had already released in Japan, they could potentially emulate it.

Dragon Warrior released in August of 1989 in the US

Dragon Quest III released in February of 1988 in Japan <- so they already knew Dragon Quest was a hot item, and Howard Lincoln talked openly about wanting to see success and believing in both Dragon Quest and Final Fantasy as brands within the US...which is why both were pushed so hard through Nintendo Power.

Actual giveaway + sales is anywhere from 1.5m to well over 1.5m depending on how you want to read into NP's own article discussing the giveaway, which incidentally was their largest growth period for subscriptions ever:

https://www.pressthebuttons.com/2014/08/how-did-nintendo-handle-the-great-dragon-warrior-giveaway.html

The way they talk about it suggests millions were given away.

This was based on a former Dragon Warrior fanbase that tracked actual sales numbers:

https://web.archive.org/web/20071021081552/www.planetnintendo.com/alefgard/dqhistory.asp

Sadly DQNN doesn't exist anymore, and there's no archive in the database I've been able to find to show original post and source links, but I will vouch for its authenticity, but here...

https://www.usgamer.net/articles/the-new-dark-age-of-dragon-quest

For a NES game...that's not modest.  That is phenomenal.  Though it's REALLY hard today to find good sales data and original source material on NES era sales, but commonly 250k was considered a resounding success, like numbers that literally built companies in the late 80's.  Even in the SNES era 500k would be considered astoundingly high.

FF4 sold only about 340k in the US, and FF6 only about 450k (yeah I was shocked to learn that was the real number).

http://vgsales.wikia.com/wiki/Final_Fantasy

----

Until Persona 5, none of the Persona games, not even 4, hit 500k outside Japan.  Not just America, but everywhere outside Japan.

Tales?  350k is considered very successful for Bandai Namco.  150~250k is fairly typical, and their higher selling games go into the 300~400k units, but it's rare.  Yet Namco classifies 250k as a success story.

So you get the point.  Sorry, as I usually do, I'm hammering it home pretty hard...making sure that nail doesn't pop up again.

 

* hangs head, ears low * sorry.

 

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4 hours ago, The Dog of Zahan said:

 

* hangs head, ears low * sorry.

 

Chin up, ears up buddy.  I wasn't looking to put you down, just correct so you know.  If anything, you should be happy because DQ1 actually started off strong.  Not nearly as strong as Nintendo hoped for, but a good starting foot.

Plus all the people who have only played DQ1 (a lot), have fond memories (never liked the game, but the music...the music was awesome, and there were dragons, and Axe Knights, and Gold Golems, and the Golem guard to a particular town that required a particular whistle as it hit like a freight truck).

If it makes you feel any better, my tone of voice was matter of factly, not scolding or anything like that.  You're a good guy, I just wanted to assure there was ample evidence to support my claim. 

Bro hug?

Edited by ignasia

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3 hours ago, ignasia said:

Chin up, ears up buddy.  I wasn't looking to put you down, just correct so you know.  If anything, you should be happy because DQ1 actually started off strong.  Not nearly as strong as Nintendo hoped for, but a good starting foot.

Plus all the people who have only played DQ1 (a lot), have fond memories (never liked the game, but the music...the music was awesome, and there were dragons, and Axe Knights, and Gold Golems, and the Golem guard to a particular town that required a particular whistle as it hit like a freight truck).

If it makes you feel any better, my tone of voice was matter of factly, not scolding or anything like that.  You're a good guy, I just wanted to assure there was ample evidence to support my claim. 

Bro hug?

* brings it in * No problem.  "Sorry" was all I could think to say when I was so disastrously misinformed.  I'm glad you weren't upset after all.  I can see where hearing that rumor represented over and over would get tiresome though.  And yes I LOVED Dragon Warrior. I rented it several times, and when it went to giveaway status, my parents made the subscription and game a Christmas gift that year. 

Edited by The Dog of Zahan
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