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Digital Advertising and Dragon Quest thread


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Link: https://www.reddit.com/r/dragonquest/comments/97jvi7/digital_advertising_and_dragon_quest/

What do you guys think of this thread, it was made on the DQ reddit and it really explained alot and highlighted whats really going on behind the scenes and explicity at the forefront of the DQ XI current advertising.

Do you guys agree with these statements and see them being executed now or do you disagree with some parts or agree again, comment below on what you agree with and took out of this 

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I use adblocker, so I'm not in a position to weigh in on the prevalence of DQ ads, but behavioral targeting is in fact a thing. I ended up studying women's fashion as part of art and design a few years ago, and it was really awkward to use the computer in public because of the ads for women's clothes.

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That's Liamland (who posts here under the same name).

I can definitely attest from my own experience to its authenticity.  Plus the man is deeply embedded in marketing, it's kind of his whole life.  Though typically from a musical standpoint, it's not much different.  Essentially this is an area of expertise for him.

Yes, he is very intelligent.

Edited by ignasia
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57 minutes ago, ignasia said:

That's Liamland (who posts here under the same name).

I can definitely attest from my own experience to its authenticity.  Plus the man is deeply embedded in marketing, it's kind of his whole life.  Though typically from a musical standpoint, it's not much different.  Essentially this is an area of expertise for him.

Yes, he is very intelligent.

I see so you haven't been seeing DQ XI ad banner posts/youtube because of frequency capping and you already being an obvious fan of dq through search history?

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One thing I'd argue with is that it isn't easy for them to just separate "the hardcore DQ crowd" from other JRPG fans, or similar potential audiences.

Like, what are they going to filter on? Someone who watched a ton of videos on Dragon Question, and searched for the games on various storefronts or Google? These might easily be people who are interested in the history of the series, but aren't necessarily committed to purchasing DQ11.

This is in fact a pretty common issue with targeted advertising. It often happens that I look around for stuff, find what I need, but then I keep getting ads for the exact same stuff for the next year, despite not needing it anymore. Even from the same store/provider *where I ended up getting it*, despite the fact that my conversion should be very easily trackable. Nah, it's easier for the advertiser to use the scattergun approach. As a matter of fact, I am seeing a lot of ads for DQXI, despite having preordered the game from Square Enix's own store.
That said, I'm sure Liamland knows what he's talking about, and it's not unlikely than an effort is being made to avoid wasting ad space on people who are getting the game anyway, I'm just not sure if it's working.

Besides, it's not like it's completely worthless to advertise your product to someone who already bought it. It's called strengthening your brand value, and is a very central part of Dragon Quest's marketing (hence all the spinoffs, etc.)

 

What I'm seeing out there is a lot of the opposite approach. People see ads for Dragon Quest but immediately assume that they are just getting them because they've been searching for a lot of DQ related stuff, while other people aren't seeing them.
That's probably also true, but the fact that a DQ ad finds you so easily means that it's definitely also gonna find a ton of other people who aren't as aware of its impending release.

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6 hours ago, muddy120 said:

I see so you haven't been seeing DQ XI ad banner posts/youtube because of frequency capping and you already being an obvious fan of dq through search history?

Given how many youtube videos I watch, yes.  Initially I saw three banners back to back, then two youtube videos back to back.  Then it took a week and a half for the next youtube video (with banner).  This while getting closer to release, which is usually when marketing ramps up, not tones down.  As we're getting closer, I see far fewer.

One thing I have noticed is that we're seeing zero TV spots.  Just online streaming tv spots and banners.

I have noticed on other sites outside of Youtube, I saw two banners, and for the last month I've seen nothing.  Nada.  I'd wager the tracking cookies, and my lack of banner clicking activity, despite thumbing up the DQ commercials three times, are the main reasons.  I frequent a lot of DQ sites, including Japanese sites, and the main DQ site, including going to the SE and Amazon pages since.  So depending on whether tracking cookies are present on my system based on those commercials (and likely there are), it would indicate my history demonstrates I'm not a prime target as I likely already have a copy, or are already interested and continually so, so whether they track enough to indicate a purchase (say I sign into amazon and check my purchase history and they note this, or just my account name and that there's a purchase order linked to it), or just enough tracking to where just my presence on those DQ sites, especially purchase sites, my history would definitely assure the lack of commercials my way.

I hadn't thought of this until seeing Liam's post, but his description of how this works has been going on since the 90's and the first expansion of the internet into a more unified concept of web pages and hubs, and away from the AOL chatrooms (and those like them), and gopher, or the original FTP servers for sharing files, etc.  They've just gotten better and smarter, and much of it ties to tracking your frequented sites through your ISP...yeah, that part can be scary, and it's why VPNs are in style right now.

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Thanks for the kind words.

I wrote that post on Reddit because I was seeing more than a few posts from people saying it was a marketing issue that they're not seeing DQXI ads online when digital advertising is far more complex than that. I've also explained that exact scenario to sales people multiple times over the years: why one might not see an ad while others would. It's my industry, so I'm embedded in this whole process. ignasia has known me since back in the early 2000s from the Old Enix Forums (our Dragon Warrior VII days) when I worked at MTV Networks commercial ops. I've spent the past 14 years in digital advertising operations and recently switched from publishing to the agency side.

@Sumez It actually is that easy if they setup their behavioral tracking pixels the right way. It is possible to behavioral track almost any action online if the site can accept tracking pixels, and the pixels are positioning on the right pages to track the action. You can search for a movie on Netflix, then go to a news site and see an ad for Amazon trying to sell you the movie you just searched for. That's all sophisticated behavioral tracking. There are Digital Marketing Platforms that sell targetable user-data showing suspected age, household income, gender, hobbies, and general to specific surfing habits. Data is a big money maker.

Certain social sites like Facebook might not accept tracking pixels because they want to keep their behavior tracking proprietary, within their own ad server. So that would prevent AND targeting between a display and a social campaign.

And while it's not worthless to advertise to keep the hype up among hardcores, with a game like DQXI there is more value in trying to attract new players. I preordered on Amazon, and I don't get many ads, but I do get them. That's more likely due to frequency capping or maybe what I saw was an ad from a programmatic auction.

@ignasia Yeah, it can get scary. In a follow up post to my original Reddit post, I mentioned I was talking to a coworker about a mosquito trap I was interested in buying, and then about an hour later he gets a mosquito trap ad on Instagram, without ever having searched about one. His iPhone X picked up on the conversation, identified keywords that they then shared with advertisers to dynamically serve him a mosquito trap ad.

Even scarier on a Minority Report level, a vendor came to my company recently and pitched the ability to cross reference phone carrier data and ad targeting. Meaning they can locate where you are based on your smartphone, and serve you an ad if you're geographically close to where you can buy something. For example they can see if you're near a McDonalds restaurant and then they can have a McDonalds ad automatically serve to your phone through either social media, an app, or any random website.

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