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I know I posted this a while ago, but looks like the topic was removed. Also new games have been released.

 

If there was a Dragon Quest time line like the Zelda timeline what do you think it would be and why? We all know the Roto trilogy basically goes Dragon Quest III- Dragon Quest- Dragon Quest II, and the Zenithian timeline basically goes Dragon Quest VI- Dragon Quest IV- Dragon Quest V. But where on the time line would these two trilogies relate to eachother and where would the newer games fall?

 

I personally have the feeling that Dragon quest IX would fall twords the begining because of the whole demons and god motief. That may then be followed by Dragon Quest VII, a time when god stops playing as much of a direct role in the worlds. Drragon Quest VIII is an odd one maybe that would take place between VII and Either the Roto trilogy or zenithian trilogy. Also seeing as how there are two worlds seperated from each other in the Roto trilogy it's easy to wonder if the first world in Dragon quest III gave rise to any of the other worlds in the game series. I mean Zenith does sort of appear in Dragon quest III. So yeah what would your time line be?

 

Forgot to mention the Dragon Quest monsters games. Obviously Dragon quest Monsters Caravan Hearts takes place in the Dragon Quest II world so that really confuses where Dragon Quest VII would be in the timeline. As the game features a trip to Dragon Quest II's world far after Dragon Quest II takes place. Also Caravan hearts has one of the heros from VII so unless there is time and space travel going on, my previous theory about Vii taking place far before the Roto trilogy would be in question.

Edited by SamTheWeebo
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Cool read, just FYI the "Dragon Quest Item Storybook is no longer available on Archive.org, I grabbed the "Dragon Quest IV - Legend in the Dark" just in case it disappears as well.

This.   Unless the worlds go through some crazy apocalyptic $#!& that requires all life to start over and reshape the entire world, there's not a timeline for the entire ser

Huh, how'd this get to be two pa-  

The Zenith and Lots trilogies cross in DQ3, but I cannot help you further.

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Nothing gets deleted here. I remember that topic, but don't pay attention enough to comment on anything.

Oh sorry for my misunderstanding then. Guess I just didn't look hard enough for my old topic. My mistake

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It could have if it got derailed bad enough there have been a few topics zapped

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The simple answer? Don't worry about it and enjoy the games. As much as fans want to make a timeline out of things, characters are put into games just 'cuz folks like them and it's a fun bonus.

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I actually made a timeline theory myself here on the den. It goes as in-depth as I could make it, and covers Monsters and the Torneko games. Normally, I'd give you a link, but I'll just tell you what I know. DQ3 definitely came first, since I couldn't find anything that proved otherwise. The bonus dungeon in 3 is called Cloudsgate Citadel in the Android port, the same name that Zenithia had before the Zenith Dragon took charge. Monsters 1 and 2 serve as prequels to DQ6, which is pretty much Zenithia's backstory. Next, we meet Torneko Taloon in DQ4, help him fund his shops in the Torneko games, meet him in Young Yangus, DQ8, and DQ9, and buy stuff from him in DQ10. The hero from Monsters Joker, according to a Japanese fan theory, eventually becomes Orgodemir due to years of monster training mutating him into a demon. Meanwhile, Joker 2 features a monster called Baby Bjorn, who looks virtually identical to Bjorn the Behemoose from DQ5, which happens afterwards. DQ1 and 2 reveal the return of Yggdrasil Leaves, which presumably went extinct sometime before DQ5. Caravan Heart, while it does take place in Torland, the setting for DQ2, clearly happens a long time afterwards, or at least that's what the NPCs seem to imply. DQ7's present era would take place furthest in the timeline, with its past era not long after DQ4. And there's my two cents on the matter.

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Why the French toast does everyone and their grandma want to make timelines for game series that don't need one/clearly don't have one in the first place? I'm sure the obvious answer is "It's for fun," but I don't care either way. It's a fascination I've never understood and likely never will.

 

Rant over, go back to your business.

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Really, if you want to "Timeline" the series, you cannot.

 

There's the Loto Trilogy and the Zenith Trilogy, which is timelined.

 

Stuff like Caravan Heart are just throwbacks, and have no bearing in a timeline.

 

 

DQ ain't Zelda.

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Pretty much the games are in entirely separate universes.  DQ6 and DQ8 pretty much demonstrate this with the concepts of Zenithia and Ramia/Empyrea.  All crossover elements are fanservice only.  Heck, as Horii was making 4, 5, and 6, he wanted to create them as independent worlds, so the idea seemed to be create so little connection between them with each subsequent game, that it makes it easier for fans to transition to DQ7, the first true stand-alone.

 

DQ1-3 are the same world, and each game has a very direct connection to each other.  DQ4-6 are connected by Zenithia, with only 4 and 5 being classified as the same world by lore, and other elements (Zenithia being only physical for one, whereas in 6 it's spiritual only, similarly to 3).  7 is stand alone, 8 is...then 9 is, and finally 10.

 

Heck, the God in 7 and 9 are so removed from one another they couldn't possibly be the same.  9's is modeled after Zeus, and is about 100,000x more angry at humanity than biblical God ever was (kind of like the Sumerian Gods in their own flood story...men are too whiny and useless and greedy so let's kill'em all!), while Celestria is modeled as a female crossover of both Freja of Norse mythology and a female Jesus (there's another Goddess mixed up in there somewhere).  While the God of 7 is clearly a comical rendition of a more judeo-christian version, and while he's strict and kind of a stuck-up ass, he cares very much for humanity, and is the literal concept of an old man in the clouds.  This cannot be married with Zenus, since Zenus is split into 12 parts, unlikely to ever reform again, and cannot age, as the story of 9 takes place in a world that has seen perhaps untold millions of years prior to even the event that led to the Celestrians.  Heck, in many ways the 9 storyline is almost like a reworking of the Ragnarok tale, and Corvus in many ways resembles Loki as much as he does Satan...actually fits Lucifer better (Satan, prior to the concept of Lucifer being the one and only Satan, was typically Samael, sometimes Bhaal, sometimes Baphomet, and Andareal, or even Set and Beelzebub).  Whereas 7's demonlord is more pure Satanic in construct and story, though nothing about him reeks of a fallen angel, more like a prime-evil being, like most of the demon lords of the DQ universe.

 

 

 

So, let's assume for a second they are all in the same universe, if not the same world, working interdimensionally, and there is a real timeline.   For the sake of fun...

 

It's hard to say of DQ's 7, 9, and 10, which would come first or last, but we can do something with 1-6 and 8.  9, well we can always use the concept that interdimensional time portals, allowing for Legacy bosses, means any boss from any point in time, so the relevance of the origin of the being within space-time is irrelevant.

 

In the case of 1-6 and 8... - = within 100 years

 

6 -----------> 3 -> 1 -> 2 --------------------> 4 > 8 ------------------------------> 5

 

Here's my reasoning.

 

6 starts as the first world with Zenithia, and it's tied down for centuries upon centuries.  The story notion is that Mortamor had already conquered the world of DQ6 so many years ago, that most of these demon lords have been long standing rulers of their respective areas.  Dhuran was the first to come in, and we know Sorceria was destroyed then sealed roughly 1,000 years before events.  So Dhuran = pre-1,000 years ago.  Meaning that Zenithia has been trapped, as a spiritual castle, as it was part of only the spirit world in 6, in the real world, manifested as a demonic castle that seeks to attack, as a test, any that might succor entry, so that Dhuran can fight worthy adversaries.

 

So if DQ3 is earlier, then it's at least 1,000 years prior to events in 6, in a different world, as like with 6, Zenithia is NOT a physical castle, but a spiritual one, helping to govern, on a lower level than Divine Dragon/Shinryu all worlds, as it is connected to all worlds, as an overseer of the dream world, and the master of the spirits there.  Think of it like the heart of Christian heaven if you want, with King Zenith overseeing souls, and in all worlds his castle spawns in that individual dimension individually, but all Zeniths are the same Zenith no matter the split.  However it makes more sense for DQ3 to come after 6, since again, we have no idea just how long Mortamor had locked Zenithia in place, and with it locked in place in one world, all Zenithias would be locked in place.  Thus I would prefer 6 as the starting point, especially given the nature of 3's version of Zenithia.  The whole castle is no longer present, which would fit better in context with DQ4's storyline.  However, this would be the origin of DQ4, not the current time, given there's a huge amount of pre-history of Master Dragon saving the world of 4 from the evil Esturk.

 

Due to these elements, and because of the ending sequence to DQ6, with the hatching of a Dragon Egg, we can assume that with the birth of the Zenith Dragon, a new form of Zenithia can now take shape in the physical plane, in a world that obviously requires an overseer (recall that DQ6's world does not, and it is implied it does not, and all the other clear and obvious elements that would imply different worlds).  So DQ4's world would have a new, permanent, physical Deity that is a Dragon, known as Zenith Dragon, that rules Zenithia, as ONLY a physical element of this world, albeit in the clouds.  The only path being the tower, and the only requirement being to equip the Zenithian equipment to scale the tower.  So DQ4's world would have to be around the same time as DQ3's.  Both being in entirely separate planets if you want, but roughly the same time.  DQ3's remakes give us Zenithia, but only King Zenith, in a spiritual world, as a guardian type, mid-level, as it is halfway to the true dragon guardian, Shinryu.  So this implies a split Zenithia, and two separate forms.  The spirit remains in control by King Zenith, and the physical is by Master Dragon, or Zenith Dragon if you want (I like Master Dragon more =p).

 

1 and 2 we know.  8 would have to be after 3, since with 3's end, Ramia is released from her charge of saving that world, and being free from her egg, can now go anywhere.  We know from 8 that she was from a different world.  8's story also takes place at least 1,000 years after the events of the past where Rhapthorne was sealed away into the Staff.  We also know that Ramia had been fighting Rhapthorne for a very long time prior to that point.  As in until the Sage's had come around, Ramia had been battling, along with probably the Dragon Clan, Rhapthorne for what is implied as a very very long time.  So it's fair to give another 1,000 years.  So somewhere over 2,000 years after events in 3, Ramia came to 3's world.  We have no idea if there were other worlds in between.  Other battles.  So 8 could be hundreds of thousands of years later, but for the sake of sanity, and simplicity, let's say it was immediately after the events in 3.

 

Now, we know from historical bits and pieces, that thousands of years prior, there was a legendary hero who saved the world.  We also have Esturk...who, sorry Fur, but based on 4's story, Esturk does not die.  Cannot truly die.  Since Master Dragon had basically beaten him then sealed him away.  So the implication being 4's Hero defeated him, but he is resealed over time, and with so many thousands of years alone underground, recovers, and becomes far stronger than ever before.  The precedent is there in the story of 4 to allow for 5's appearance.  We already know 5 IS after 4, and while there are a lot of changes in the world, the implications are that a very very very very...very very very long period of time, in the thousands of years, has passed between.  Plus there is Zenithia, and the irony being where Nadiria's initial entrance was, the exact spot of the deepest cave, is now the world's tallest mountain.  Heck, it's been so many thousands of years that Zenithia itself has been underwater, and Master Dragon has been stuck in a cave for millenia, that Zenithia is but a myth.  So 5 would likely come last...far far into the future compared to the others.

 

Where 7, 9, and 10 come in?  I couldn't tell you.  9, let's assume is after 7 and the rest.  Just to ignore what I said earlier, and simply assume that each of the Legacy bosses were seeking new worlds to conquer having been defeated, but their spiritual essence allowed reforming into new bodies and seeking new territory.  As I said, 9's world is old.  Very, very, very old.  I mean so old that by Celestria's sacrifice, it's already ancient.  So old that after Celestria's sacrifice, and the events of 9, there have been maybe 2,000 years.  1,000 years for the time of Corvus until his fall, and another 1,000 years from Corvus to present.  10, I dunno.  7 just has no connection points, and sure there's a Meena and Maya easteregg, so maybe we can say after 4, but then that makes no sense given 8 and both Torneko and Ragnar...

 

Well, now we have a connundrum.  So I give you 4, which should fit in just prior to 8, to fit with Torneko and Ragnar...:

 

DQ4 would have to be a different world.  For one the implication is as such in the storyline, and in no remake of 4 was there any added references to the world of 6.  Two, the nature of the pathway to Zenithia is distinctly different (no tower, it's a light pathway to "heaven" and the spirit world.  Three, the "Legendary Equipment" is distinctly different, though similar, to the Zenithian equipment, and unlike the Legendary Equipment, the Zenithian do not carry symbols, nor is this an important element.  Four, the pathway to Zenithia is only physical in 4 and 5, and remains the same path, and in the exact same point of the world, the dead center of the world, both unlike 6's spiritual path that is not fixed in the center of the world.  Five, the castle is always physical, and according to the lore of Zenithia in 4, and again in 5, the castle has always been like this, and Master Dragon has always been its master.  Six, there was never any King Zenith in Zenithia, nor any concept of King Zenith, as DQ4's Master Dragon was always the lord of Zenithia (same with 5, and Master Dragon is immortal)...sorry the Zenith Dragon, if we're going by modern naming conventions.  Seven, I almost forgot, the Zenithian equipment has distinct properties that carry from 4 to 5, that are different from 6, with the sword being entirely different, and frankly a much weaker sword than the Legendary Ramias sword for which it is based on.

 

 

So with Meena and Maya in 7, we can assume that 7 and 8 happen simultaneously, but this would be the only connection.  However the implication is that Meena and Maya are PRE-4, in a fashion similar to Terry's Wonderland, in that they somehow managed to land in 7's world before the events of 4.  So 7 would be just prior to 4.

 

10, dunno, but the reworked full version of 1~9:

 

 

DQM > 6 -----> DQM2? ------> 3 -> 1 -> 2 --------------------> 7 > Caravan Heart > 4 > 8 ------------------------------> 5 -> 9 > DQM:J? ----> DQM:J2?

 

 

There is one curious element though, I would like to point out.  The spirit of Rubiss.  In DQ3 Rubiss is only in the Dark World, as this is the world of Rubiss.  In DQ2, Rubiss is the guardian of this world.  In DQ6, there is a Rubiss, and she is also a guardian spirit of that world, however, while Rubiss' is tied to the ocean in 6 as she is in 2, the implication is Rubiss has far less power in 6 than in Erdrick's territory.  One could say they're separate entities.  There's also the fact of Poseidon being in DQ6, but having no place in DQ1-3, implying separate worlds, and the concept of Rubiss being a shared concept entity, and not the same Rubiss.  Kind of like the idea of all worlds having a female guardian spirit, and in DQ, that name is Rubiss.  Or maybe Rubiss is a title rather than a proper name?  I don't know, but Rubiss has not been used outside of 3, 2, and 6.  7 has it's own unique "guardian" spirits, as the 4 elements, nullifying the need for a single guardian entity like Rubiss, and there's an undersea king, similar in nature to Poseidon of 6.  So it's kind of like Zenithia...shared entities, not the same, but there's a chance each world may have one.

 

 

 

As ridiculous as this all may seem, and especially in light of the fact that only 1-3 ARE directly connected, while 4 and 5 are, and 6 is spiritually connected to 4 and 5, enough to make a new trilogy, while 8 has a spiritual connection to 3 in the sense of Ramia...that was actually kind of fun, but I won't entertain this again.

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One thing you failed to mention (though I doesn't seem to change your timeline theory) is the tale of "The Hero Hepoko" that can be read from books in DW7. Hepoko seems to be Erdrick, as the tale basically retells the beginning of DQ3. I know it doesn't tell all of DQ3's story, though, and I don't remember where it stops. If I remember correctly, it is said to be an ancient story, which would still put 3 much before 7...

 

Another thing is the fact that there are (at least) two different points in time where 7 takes place - the "past" and the "present". the two are at least 100 years apart - I don't remember if it's mentioned anywhere in-game, but I always got the feeling that the two were 300~500 years apart. Also, this puts Caravan Heart BETWEEN 7 (past) and 7 (present), as Keifer is still a child, not a young man bent on finding "wine, women, and adventure" (well, he's still looking for the adventure part). From what I understand (I've never finished the game), Caravan Heart is still most definitely after DQ2.

 

Torneko makes an appearance in dungeons in X... I don't know the story behind it, but I'm willing to believe it's related the Mystery Dungeon. I'd say X takes place during one of the Dungeon games. I haven't run into Torneko in VIII yet, but I assume he's stuck in VIII's world (he also makes an appearance in Young Yangus, which comes before VIII).

 

DQM > 6 -----> DQM2? ------> 3 -> 1 -> 2 ---------------->7(past)----> Caravan Heart >7(present) > 4 >Torneko 1>Torneko 2>Young Yangus> 8>Torneko 3>10 ------------------------------> 5 -> 9 > DQM:J? ----> DQM:J2?

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Psaro used the secret of evolution to gain a form that was similar to Estark's.  I recall DQ4 implying that Esturk wasn't truly defeated, just banished or sealed away.  DQ5 I believe also implies it's the same Esturk, but given time te recover and grow strong after the events of DQ4.

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Interesting. I always understood it that Psaro absorbed him (or at least enough to take on his form), or something to that effect.

It's been many years since I played DQ4 DS so I'm really hazy about stuff.

 

Nah, it's just the basic fundamental form using the, already understood Secret of Evolution.  It still requires that Gold thing you find in Alena's chapter (a pseudo philosopher's stone), but given Esturk was taken down, that form, in their eyes, was clearly not sufficient, and frankly it was an old form, so they took the evolution to the next level, and thus we have Psaro.  It's also why Aamon, in the remake, goes for the same transformation as Psaro.

 

However, the form of Esturk wasn't flawed, it was more like he was just weakened, and hadn't had enough time to rest and fully recover from his battle with Master Dragon/Zenith Dragon.

 

 

One thing you failed to mention (though I doesn't seem to change your timeline theory) is the tale of "The Hero Hepoko" that can be read from books in DW7. Hepoko seems to be Erdrick, as the tale basically retells the beginning of DQ3. I know it doesn't tell all of DQ3's story, though, and I don't remember where it stops. If I remember correctly, it is said to be an ancient story, which would still put 3 much before 7...

 

Another thing is the fact that there are (at least) two different points in time where 7 takes place - the "past" and the "present". the two are at least 100 years apart - I don't remember if it's mentioned anywhere in-game, but I always got the feeling that the two were 300~500 years apart. Also, this puts Caravan Heart BETWEEN 7 (past) and 7 (present), as Keifer is still a child, not a young man bent on finding "wine, women, and adventure" (well, he's still looking for the adventure part). From what I understand (I've never finished the game), Caravan Heart is still most definitely after DQ2.

 

Torneko makes an appearance in dungeons in X... I don't know the story behind it, but I'm willing to believe it's related the Mystery Dungeon. I'd say X takes place during one of the Dungeon games. I haven't run into Torneko in VIII yet, but I assume he's stuck in VIII's world (he also makes an appearance in Young Yangus, which comes before VIII).

 

DQM > 6 -----> DQM2? ------> 3 -> 1 -> 2 ---------------->7(past)----> Caravan Heart >7(present) > 4 >Torneko 1>Torneko 2>Young Yangus> 8>Torneko 3>10 ------------------------------> 5 -> 9 > DQM:J? ----> DQM:J2?

 

Yes, yes, there is indeed the Hero Hepoko.  Obviously changed and simplified into a children's story due to the obviously huge gap in time, and from my perspective, perhaps gleaned by a writer, much as many writers today treat their fictional works as REAL stories that they were simply honoured to have gleaned from whatever source they originated from, to share with the world (no seriously, a lot of fictional writers really do believe this, because of the nature of how many of these stories come into their lives, almost like this fully fleshed out thing that you watch in real-time in your head, and I can understand this sense and feeling that this is something that happened and somehow we're tapping into these, and writing them down, adding our own flavour and flair).

 

I discount the past, because the timeline for the past is very different each spot.

 

The problem with the timeline is we have no idea of how much time has past for any one event.  A few we can tell between one another. Verdham and Litorud for example, is roughly 30 years later.  Verdham and Engow are about 2, 3, maybe as many as 5 years apart.  Enough time for your presence in Engow to be a shocker, but for the people to remember you, and the kids to still be kids.

 

Coastal's story predates the entire God vs Demon Lord battle, where Melvin is sealed.  Or perhaps it's after events, but this would make no sense, since the whole "sealing" thing occurs after the battle and he is still alive and well in Coastal's timeline, just not active there given Sharkeye is nowhere, and there's nary a mention of Melvin in Coastal anymore than Melvin has any concept of Sharkeye, suggesting Coastal was sealed off way early, and Melvin comes after the fact, so Sharkeye was the original Hero (would have to be before, since history requires that the hero's in current time travel back, and damage the demon lord to a point where he has to seal off the other lands to heal and create the whole "revive God" spiel).  Apparently demon lords need lots and lots and lots of time to heal after major battles (ala Esturk).  However, again, we're never given anything to tell us if it's 500 years, or a 1,000, or even 10,000.  Heck, it could be longer based on the condition of many elements in the world, such as the sky stone's falling, no memory of Sharkeye or Coastal, or the warriors of God.  Or that mankind ever flew in stones.  Clearly the Demon Lord is not put to sleep due to Sharkeye either, since he never makes it to the battlefield, but is instead trapped in ice before anything can happen (thanks to God, knowing he was needed for his son in the future, or else the Aquagon sword would likely be lost or in Orgy's possession, thus negating any chance of undoing the second sealing.

 

So, if you want to give it that window, that's fine, but I wouldn't touch DQ7's past timelines due to the lack of any tangible anything in terms of how much time past between past and present.

 

Nice job, and you're right, Caravan Heart should be just before events, just like with DQM1 vs DQ6.

 

 

 

We also have Esturk...who, sorry Fur, but based on 4's story, Esturk does not die

Wasn't he permanently absorbed into Psaro who, presumably, will no longer use the transformation after the post-game events? Or is it just a coincidence/he only took a part of it? O_o

 

7 and 9 are too hard to fit anywhere. The main problem with 7 being determining what parts of the world, if any, are real, due to both God and the Demon Lord's constant interference. The main problem I have with DW7 and what's real or not is that Fishbel/Estard gets sealed off twice, we've never heard any mention of the continent in any of the past stories, and we don't visit past Fishbel/Estard for some reason, though this might be something Horii never thought of.

 

Please correct me if I'm wrong... I didn't talk to NPCs this time around for DW7 (I had just played through to Hamelia a few months ago), but to my knowledge no NPCs make mention of their being other islands, either. How long ago was that continent sealed off to where there would be no recorded history of any other island?

 

Although, if we count DQM games as canon, Fishbel/Estard might be the only remnants of a chunk of Torland in the future. One thing to note assuming it isn't coincidence, is the Saint items in the Fane. Sword, Shield, Helmet and Armor. Just like Loto's arsenal in DQ2.

 

9 you have to exclude all forms of DLC because it has characters from everywhere. Otherwise... uh, I guess it could work somewhere. It could be the far future of DQ3's Light World, as that world is long forgotten about. Or maybe that world is the far future of the Dream World in DQ6. Either one could work, I guess.

 

DQM > 6 > 3* > 1 > 2 > Caravan Heart > 7 > 4 > 8 > 5

(I stole ignasia's for after 7)

 

@Erdrick the Hero: Is Hepoko the Flame Spirit? I recall him being Loto/a reincarnation or something in the manga. If it really was Loto though, it would complicate things due to Caravan Heart.

 

* - Any point after 3 can be DQ9 if you want to go with that the Light World is the DQ9 world in the far, far future.

DQM:J, DQM:J2 and DQM2 can go anywhere. None of them are particularly important to anything, to my knowledge. DQM2 probably be immediately after DQM, as kid Terry is still there.

 

DQM has crossovers aplenty, but I don't think they ever actually say the situations in the gate are real (in fact I recall one of them more or less saying it is not). So it could just be some form of a lucid dream (the boss rooms), or something.

 

 

Trying to timeline the DQ series is pretty fun, actually. Certainly better than Zelda, where all you get are, at best, rear-pulls and the convoluted concept of "three different, concurrent timelines".

 

There is no past Estard because it was always under the watch of the strongest of the 4 spirits, and the most active of them, and due to God needing the Aquaspirit semi-active for the unsealing.

 

Estard is only sealed once in the story ;).  Disc 2's sealing.

 

Hepoko wouldn't confuse things or complicate matters at all.  It's a simplified childrens story version.  What happens if a story is VERY ancient and long since turned into nothing more than a common children's tale.  Though it's also of a different world, so this would further suggest that since monsters 1, we've had the ability to jump through "wormholes" or whatever between worlds, then it stands to reason the spiritual knowledge of one story would be open to other worlds to pick it up somehow.  So for this to be so limited in scope and simplicity, despite the daring do and obvious more complex elements, such as the battle of Orochi to free an enslaved people sacrificing its daughters, we have only this simple rendition.  Thus, old, ancient, very very ancient in the histories of the omniverse of DQ, in relation to DQ7.

 

 

You're seeing this as one world, different storylines.  It can't work that way.  If you want to make it work, then USE what DQM actually gives us: the concept of string + membrane theory.  Multiple worlds sharing the same space, but being different universes.  Each universe independently having it's own set of layers, or densities, and both transference of matter and thought can occur between them.  Most commonly thought, but at times clearly larger holes can be open that allow the transfer of physical beings from one world to another.  As well, due to the nature of this omniuniverse, it stands to reason that certain elements are shared between different universes.  Such as a female guardian spirit: Rubiss.  Or even a set of guardian spirits that are attuned to specific properties of that world: the elements in DQ7, of which we've seen nothing.  Or such as a ruler of the sea: Poseidon in DQ6 and 7.

 

Think outside the box, since this CANNOT ever work, EVER, as a single world.  EVER.  It just wouldn't make any sense.  DQ5 is ancient compared to 4, and the only historical elements refer to 4's storyline.  No other world, save two sets of books that retell the stories from other DQ's in simplistic terms, much like 7 does with 3's story in the Hepoko books.  You could force it to work, but it can't.  In order to tie things together, it has to be a multi/omniverse of multiple worlds.  Heck, DQ9's world pretty much PROVES this.  There is no potential way that 7 and 9's world are the same, and yet 9 has an Orgodemir.  I don't mean 7 and 9 can possibly work as the same world in that somehow God actually dies in 7, Zenus is born, kills the world and remakes it, has a million year reign, decides to kill off humanity because they sicken him, and has his daughter stop him.  Since God is immortal and invincible in 7, and makes this perfectly clear to the party.  Nor can God of 7 and Zenus BE the same person.  Wheres celestria.  Why the difference in personality?  Why the core differences in their respective worlds?  What about Divinegon?

 

You see my point?  You can't have a singular world if you're going to be taken with any amount of credibility.  It's also why the only Zelda timeline that works, is one with an omniverse.  Forcing conformity to a singular timeline for all Zelda titles is beyond absurd.  Some are the same world, and it's either suggested, or made clear by historical references to specific other storylines.  Or it uses histories from other zelda games, or is suggestive of a game within a game: like Link's Awakening and Majora's Mask were obviously part of LttP and OoT respectively, but one is a dream, the other is child Link in between his OoT events.  Others are totally separate games, set in separate universes, and cannot work in conjunction with the other Zelda titles.

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Nimzo used the Secret of Evolution as well.

 

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Nimzo used the Secret of Evolution as well.

 

 

This is true, and came out with a different result, likely meaning it was flawed.   I don't see this as a topic for spoilers Matt.  It would be ridiculous.  I couldn't write anything if I had to write in a spoiler tag every 2 lines.  Plus the game is ancient history now.  Spoilers be damned for any game but DQX.

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Wow love the response. There is something I thought of though. How many worlds are there in the Dragon Quest universe and how are they connected? We know that there are at least a light and dark world in Dragon Quest 3, So each of those has a time line. We know the history of the dark world after 3 goes ?.....<3.....<1......<2......<Caravan hearts. What came before 3 in the dark world I'm not sure. Maybe that area was the demon realm for a bunch of dragon quest games. As for dragon quest 9 I feel as though that world is the dream world from dragon quest 6. It can connect to any other time and place because it is a dream. Many different heroes can stay at the inn in there dreams. God can be totally different and even opposite because it is god's dream. All the bosses from other games can be there because again the world is the dream world. I feel therefore that 9 sort of exists out of the time line. At some point in 9's past or future it becomes tied to the or a real world and the events of dragon quest 6 happen. After 6 the dream world fades back to where it belongs leaving behind a castle and some legendary powers and weapons born from the merger of dreams and reality.

 

 

So we have at least the light world, dark world, and dream world. Which I find interesting because those are the worlds in dragon quest 6. There are likely more worlds as each world seems to fragment into at least a normal world and a demon world. You might be able to connect every demon world to the dark world in 3. But idk Just some thoughts to throw in there

 

Oh also I think 7 happens after 5 because of Estark. In dragon quest 5 there is one Estark, but in 5 he has a son. By the time of 7 estarks are regular foes. Makes me think starkers reproduced a lot and weakened leading to a line of normal monsters.

 

That's all for now.

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Like in my response to Erdrick, it could just be an extremely LONG period of time.  We have no sense of how much time between the "soonest" present and the past were.  As I said, Coastal could be as old as 10,000 years, maybe even older.  We just don't know.  So there's plenty of time for old records to become lost, and for even later generations to explore and find nothing for years, tens of years, even a few hundred years, and as a result bury or destroy those ancient records (bury most likely, as I'd wager the old man on the cliff has any surviving records indicating other islands...heck he's the only one who isn't surprised by Rexwood's appearance).

 

Human history, in the real world, is replete with examples of historical documents going missing, or being buried in libraries and treated as mythology or stricken from the records (even if the original document still exists), just to quell any challenges to conventional history.

 

With what we've been finding since the 1600's, human history likely goes back 10's of thousands of years, if not 100's of thousands of years.  This would coincide with some oral and written histories in China, Tibet, and India, which indicate humanity is ANCIENT, and we've had these ongoing process of build advanced civilization, then it gets destroyed.  Man becomes like an animal again, then resets and rebuilds again.  Yet we, in this present time, seem to forget these elements.  It used to be taught in history classes, that giant men used to roam the planet.  We actually had giant skeletons of humans all over the place in Western Europe, to the United States, up until about the 1960's.  As the modern theory of evolution became more and more popular, suddenly not only did these skeletons, actual human skeletons of fantastic sizes and proportions, disappear, but most history books now ignore their presence, and most historians treat all of the finds, even by prominent archeologists, as hoaxes.  Now we believe such things never existed.  That the smithsonian never had a whole room filled with 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16...up to 20 ft tall skeletons, with one femur belonging to what can only be a 60ft upright walking humanoid, as the structure is modern human.  Same with some artifacts that, using various dating techniques, are anywhere from 250 to 2.5 million years old, some that are almost several billion years old due to the layers found in, and total lack of contamination over several billions of years of sediment from other layers.

 

I'm just saying, history, even within 50 years, can be altered and changed to a point where even the most well-versed historian will claim what was once known, not suggested or theorized, but known to be true, as false history without any proof to the contrary of the older and likely far more accurate historical record.

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Ok, I still think your seriously over thinking this.

 

I think the Erdrick / Loto trilogy and the Zenithian trilogy are not related, and 7, 8, 9 are all seperate.

 

Likely the case, but thinking about other possibilities is fun. :) It's fun to look at things you love with a fine tooth comb. ;)

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Nimzo didn't have the Armlet of Transmutation or whatever it is.

 

Psaro did. :) But Aamon made him batshit nuts.

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I'm not much for going over anything with a fine toothed comb even if I like it. I just simply enjoy what I like.

I'm like that too. I don't put extra thought into things. I'm more of someone who looks at the surface and takes it for face value.
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I'm not much for going over anything with a fine toothed comb even if I like it. I just simply enjoy what I like.

I'm like that too. I don't put extra thought into things. I'm more of someone who looks at the surface and takes it for face value.

 

LOL, I'm both ways.  I do that when I'm enjoying it.  Afterwards it's a source of inspiration, so if I have to use my imagination, or feel like using it, to find more elements hidden within, I do so.  I also find that everytime I replay a game or reread a book, I find new elements I had either not noticed the first, second, third, fourth, fifth, etc. time before, or notice other highlights.  So I took that to mean what I enjoy at any one moment is what I'm also paying parcel and attention to at that moment, and the next replay I'm looking for other things automatically, and yet not really consciously looking for them, or trying to find them.

 

So for me it's all and one.  The fun of this is that I can rewatch the same movie 30 times and be totally surprised by the ending, as in being fully absorbed in the moment, and after see those other elements.

 

It also helps push my own writing forward, as I gives me more to contemplate in terms of levels of writing and experiencing any one thing.

 

Dunno, but I understand yours and Lily's position on taking things straight up, and enjoying a thing in the moment for what it was meant to be, or maybe it's how we each individually want to enjoy it, for what we want from a thing.  I guess for some there's such an absence of self, that it becomes just the thing itself.

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The simple answer? Don't worry about it and enjoy the games. As much as fans want to make a timeline out of things, characters are put into games just 'cuz folks like them and it's a fun bonus.

 

Yeah I really never saw the big need for everything to be connected like the connections made between the Zelda games. Honestly, the individual stories are good on their own. I feel like the Zelda "timeline" was weak and phoned in even though its technically official now thanks to Hyrule Historia.

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I think the LoZ timeline is BS, plain and simple. Convoluted crap that wasn't necessary to begin with. It's basically trying to tie the games when they don't need to be, and that has been causing me to lose interest in the series I once loved... the games where they try to be more serious has also hurt my opinion of LoZ. LoZ does have the flaw of trying to tie newer games to much older ones, you didn't need this crap back in the NES / SNES era, you just played and enjoyed LoZ.

 

Games in a series don't need a connection. Like Mario series I don't know if there's a connection there's so many games. FF has common running elements that tie the series together (Chocobos, Moogles, the crystals, etc.), but the games don't seem to be connected at all... excpet by the theory that after FF 5 Gilgy shows up in each game and is supposedly same guy (FF 9 I think is pushing it a bit though), but that's explained because he got stuck in the void which I guess is the space between the worlds which aren't connected.

Sounds like you're taking "I don't care about timelines" too seriously...

Edited by YangustheLegendaryBandit
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Oh forgot to try to include dragon quest swords in the conversation :laugh: . Does anyone know how many bosses used the secret of evolution? Any besides Psaro, Estark, and Nismo? What was Mortomor using to transform? Can we make any more connections with the knowledge of evolution here? I know Mattcraft was talking about that a bit earlier.

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