Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
Aeana

A thread for my tinkering with DQ10

Recommended Posts

I think I've sorted out most of the direst issues. I really, really want to release tomorrow, but I need a bit to sit down and finish translating the things I wanted done for the first release. No promises, but I'll try.

 

I'll just drop this here.

 

dq10-skillscreen.png

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Wow this is pretty incredible, great work Aeana! On a side, unrelated note, for some reason, whenever I open the chat monitor app when i'm in game (or out even) it doesn't seem to pick up or display any text for me, any ideas on how I can fix that?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Take your time with it, but when you do make those tools to help those wanting to translate, ill start goin around forums and facebook pages to spread the word on it.  That and maybe a example of translated NPC text. 

Edited by Alexandrious

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Don't hurry on our account. I, for one, am far too grateful to you to ever want you to feel rushed.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Wow this is pretty incredible, great work Aeana! On a side, unrelated note, for some reason, whenever I open the chat monitor app when i'm in game (or out even) it doesn't seem to pick up or display any text for me, any ideas on how I can fix that?

It's probably not finding it. The method I used for finding the text is not perfect. You can help me make it better by downloading this program. Running it once you are logged into your character, hit the dump button, and it should make a file in the same directory as the EXE. Give me that file and I'll find out why it isn't finding the text and try to release an update. And if the program doesn't make the file, try running it as administrator.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

But yea Aeana take your time, I would like to though once ya get a chance, see one screenshot example of translated NPC text once you find a way to do it and created the tools needed for others to do that work.  It be easier to show it around to find interested parties. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

NPC text isn't part of the plan right now. It isn't feasible to do at all with the setup I'm using to translate, because it's loaded into memory on demand. I would need to find a way to detect that it's been loaded and replace it before it's displayed, which I haven't figured out. It would be another story if I could pack translations into the files on the disk, but I don't know how to do that, either.

 

I hope that people weren't getting their hopes up that this would be translating dialog. It is and always was a menu translation. I had an entirely separate plan for story dialog that would not involve translating it on-seen in-game, but rather presenting a translation in a window outside of the game. But it was just something I was toying with the idea of.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

NPC text isn't part of the plan right now. It isn't feasible to do at all with the setup I'm using to translate, because it's loaded into memory on demand. I would need to find a way to detect that it's been loaded and replace it before it's displayed, which I haven't figured out. It would be another story if I could pack translations into the files on the disk, but I don't know how to do that, either.

 

I hope that people weren't getting their hopes up that this would be translating dialog. It is and always was a menu translation. I had an entirely separate plan for story dialog that would not involve translating it on-seen in-game, but rather presenting a translation in a window outside of the game. But it was just something I was toying with the idea of.

 

Are there any methods to "scan" a dialogue box into maybe a separate file, from which you could copy/paste? Google translate ain't great, but even garbled sentences could help direct a player.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah, honestly, a menu translation is probably the most important thing in the end, anyway. That's the major hurdle to overcome that would cause a lot more players to be willing to play the game. There's so many ways to get the storyline across, but having the gameplay info right in front of you is really important!  :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

NPC text isn't part of the plan right now. It isn't feasible to do at all with the setup I'm using to translate, because it's loaded into memory on demand. I would need to find a way to detect that it's been loaded and replace it before it's displayed, which I haven't figured out. It would be another story if I could pack translations into the files on the disk, but I don't know how to do that, either.

I hope that people weren't getting their hopes up that this would be translating dialog. It is and always was a menu translation. I had an entirely separate plan for story dialog that would not involve translating it on-seen in-game, but rather presenting a translation in a window outside of the game. But it was just something I was toying with the idea of.

 

 

Are there any methods to "scan" a dialogue box into maybe a separate file, from which you could copy/paste? Google translate ain't great, but even garbled sentences could help direct a player.

Yes, this is almost certainly possible, and it would be the basis for what I described above. I wouldn't mind releasing a program that spits out the Japanese text first before I start pairing it with translated lines.

 

I realize that what I'm offering here is suboptimal. I, too, would rather just have all of the text translated in-game. My skills just don't extend far enough to make that a reality. I've learned a lot the last few weeks, and maybe eventually I'll gain the knowledge necessary to do this all differently... but until then, this is all I've got.

 

I actually got really upset tonight because I realized that I couldn't translate NPC menu options using the method I'm using now. The game loads these into memory literally right before they're displayed, and removes them once they're off-screen. I fiddled around a lot, and I think I may have come up with an way to make it work, but it's a bit of a hack. Not being able to translate those would make this whole effort a failure in my eyes, though, because it's one of those things people need to be able to understand the most. And that's why I'm not releasing today, even though I said I would.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well, don't be too disheartened. Really what you've accomplished already was beyond my expectations. I figured the text would have been obscured. Well, given that the text isn't encrypted in memory.... There's a *small* chance that it'll be in the network packets unencrypted. It's almost not worth mentioning. I guess there's only one way to find out. Packet sniffing. Hopefully the login/password details are encrypted, and the NPC text is sent over unencrypted. If the login details aren't encrypted, then SE is a worse company than I thought. :P That said, it could be one entry into translating the game text.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pcap

http://www.winpcap.org/

If that doesn't work out, then I've got another idea that I want to try. When you change stuff in memory, is it updated automatically, or is a menu reload needed? So, say the Menu says "Talk" and you change the text in memory to say "Speak" would it change from talk to speak without any other input from the user? Also, do you know if the menu fonts different from the main dialogue font?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Oh, it's not that the text is hard to find. It's all loaded into memory before it's displayed. It's just another case of it loading in when it's being used, and removed when it's not. It means I can't include it in this patcher I've made for the menu translations because that's intended to be run once when you log in and the text remains translated, because the game keeps it in memory. The method I am working on for translating NPC menu options actually uses the same method I'd need to use to translate on-screen dialog, it's just on a much, much, much smaller scale because the set of possible options is quite limited. What I'll be doing for these NPC menu options is including a checkbox on the patcher that will continually scan for the presence of options and swap in translations if there are any contained in the internal database. Since this will be a continuously running loop, that means my program will have to remain open in the background. It's a stupid, crappy thing but at least it allows me to offer translations. It's up to the user to decide whether they want to use it or not.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If the dialogue is outside the game window, that's fine by me.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

For translation, could you consider keeping romanji for spells? (E.g. Io, Iora, Ionaszun rather than boom, kaboom). I feel DQ's spells in English ruin the mood of the game completely.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

A lot of English players would be completely lost then. But I hate SE's English names too. What about the Enix-era spell names? They don't ruin the mood, at least in my eyes.

Edited by Erdrick The Hero

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The goal of my translation is to make it friendly for English players, so I'm going to be using the official names for as many spells and abilities as I can in the first set of files I release, since that's what they're familiar with. That doesn't mean it isn't possible to make a separate set of files that calls them other things, but it's not my priority. I'll be happy to release alternate versions of the files that use other naming conventions, and once I clean up my tools, people will be able to make any changes they wish on their own without me.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

A lot of English players would be completely lost then. But I hate SE's English names too. What about the Enix-era spell names? They don't ruin the mood, at least in my eyes.

I always thought I was pretty alone in this. The DQ translations in general drive me nuts. I wish we still had DW-era translations, I really do.

 

The worst is the dialog (which doesn't really apply in this situation but still...).

 

I dunno if it's worth the effort, but Aeana could do the DQ5R PS2 translation job, where there's both DQ and DW styles depending on which version of the patch you download.

Edited by Polantaris

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

As someone who played all of the Dragon Quest games in Japanese first, I feel like the new spell names reflect the Japanese much better than the older Dragon Warrior names. Not really a big fan of the DW ones. They're abbreviated or truncated in a lot of cases, and in some cases strangely inaccurate (infernos for wind spells? huh.), but I recognize that people have good memories of those so I'm perfectly willing to accommodate, especially when it's so very easy to make such changes with my system.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sometimes, this game makes me so angry!

 

dq10-spacing.png

 

This is literally the only menu where this is an issue, so far. These same strings appear fine in other places.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hey, it's legible!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This is literally the only menu where this is an issue, so far. These same strings appear fine in other places.

 

Kinda feel the same way when I'm doing a web page.

 

rRkZAiR.gif

 

(I could do the same thing in PageMaker in 1992 and it would work.)

 

Regarding spell names, I always figured "infernos" was a decision to make it sound like a more powerful spell. Nobody 'round here would've ever really known it was a wind spell until V's animation. Crack is the only name I still take issue with, because it sounds more like a lightening spell than ice.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I guess it was too much to ask for the ol' DQ/DW translation thing to not crop up in this one thread at least? Oh well  :laugh:

 

Anyway, those screenshots are exciting, even if a bit squished! This is really coming along, it seems.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If I can manage to find the font character widh table, I should be able to fix this issue, but it's proving to be elusive at this point.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I absolutely love the progress you are making here, thank you so much for all your efforts and keeping us up to date ^^. When you release those tools to do our own translations, I will start doing a German translation.

 

Don't get too mad about that single screen with squished spell names. I understand that you're aiming for perfection (and I would probably do the same...), but what you already achieved is more than awesome and I'm sure everyone will fully appreciate your translation despite little flaws like that. Take your time, though! No need to rush things. :)

 

On a side note I noticed that you translated "スーパースター" as "Superstar". Is that just an early translation? You said you were trying to use official translations whenever possible, so I thought you might find the following list of official vocation names useful:

 

戦士 - Warrior
僧侶 - Priest
魔法使ㄠ- Mage
武闘家 - Martial Artist
盗賊 - Thief
旅芸人 - Minstrel
ãƒãƒˆãƒ«ãƒžã‚¹ã‚¿ãƒ¼ - Gladiator
パラディン - Paladin
魔法戦士 - Armamentalist
レンジャー - Ranger
賢者 - Sage
スーパースター - Luminary
ã¾ã‚‚ã®ä½¿ã„ - Monster Master
ã©ã†ã使ㄠ- No official translation available
 
ã©ã†ã使ㄠ(DÅ gu tsukai) translates as tool user, but is often called "item master" at the Den. Someone here called it "Machinist" which I think sounds much better.
 
DÅ gu tsukai reminds me of Lucca from Chrono Trigger, so I tried to find out what her job was called to get at least some kind of official translation. The only word I found was inventor but that doesn't really sound like a good name for a character class.
 
Personally I prefer "Machinist", "Architect" or "Engineer". But of course that's completely up to you. ;)
Edited by bjaxx87

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...