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Aeana

A thread for my tinkering with DQ10

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Thanks for testing it, Bunk. Gen tested it for me, too. Seems it worked for both of you. I was hoping to get a bit more feedback, but I guess this'll do.

I've tracked down the system text and figured out the format, so I'll be implementing that before the formal release. System text includes all of the combat log data, experience gain, quest alerts, etc. that appear on the first tab of the social window, so it's the last piece of the puzzle for this particular program.

 

Here's what it's looking like now for those who didn't try the test version. Well, for the most part. Now the labels on the left are horizontally centered within the colored blocks, but I forgot to get a screenshot of that.

 

dqxcm5.png

 

This is the format I'll be sticking with for the time being. The format of the system text will be a little different, of course.

 

I know people have expressed interest in something that reads out the actual on-screen dialog. I'd like to work on something like that next if I can find the time. My actual desire here is to be able to coordinate a fan translation effort that pulls text from a hand-translated text database based on the text that's on the screen. This seems much more feasible for my own skill set than reverse-engineering the actual data file formats and trying to re-insert translated text. But we'll have to see what I can figure out.

Edited by Aeana

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I know people have expressed interest in something that reads out the actual on-screen dialog. I'd like to work on something like that next if I can find the time. My actual desire here is to be able to coordinate a fan translation effort that pulls text from a hand-translated text database based on the text that's on the screen. This seems much more feasible for my own skill set than reverse-engineering the actual data file formats and trying to re-insert translated text. But we'll have to see what I can figure out.

That would be cool, kind of like what Faolan was working on, but much easier that dealing with screen scrapes! Great work so far. If you could even just get the menus to work that way, I would definitely be buying DQX

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I've repurposed this thread so that I can use it for posting about whatever tinkering I'm doing with the game at the moment, instead of making a new one. Inspired by Woodus's request, I started looking at translating the menus, which seems to be more doable than I'd originally expected. Here's a proof of concept:

 

dq10-menus.png

dq10-menus2.png

dq10-menus3.png

 

There are some limitations to this, particularly when it comes to string length, but I'm reasonably confident that I can come up with something decent here.

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I second Dwaine. Holy $#!&, that is awesome, realtime menu translation. I will have to get my credit card out if you can publish this one :)

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dq10-menus.png

 

 

lip_licker.gif

I second Dwaine. Holy $#!&, that is awesome, realtime menu translation. I will have to get my credit card out if you can publish this one :)

I just assumed Dwaine's gif was checking out the girl in that picture.

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Doh >.<

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While working on an automated way to handle patching this stuff, I created a dump of one of the text sectors. This one contains a lot of the main menu text, but not stuff like ability names. Here it is in XML format. The thing that strikes me most is that there's a fair bit of wasted space, which is good news for translation since each sector is going to be limited to the same total number of bytes it took in memory before (unless someone more talented than me comes along to remedy this; I know it's possible, it's just outside of my skillset). However, it's easy enough to change how many bytes are allocated to each individual string and with this much wasted space, things are looking good.

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Even if you had to truncate some things it would still be way useful

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I made a short video demonstrating the progress I made tonight. Please keep in mind that these translations were extremely quick and dirty and not at all final!

 

 

Long ways to go, but a nice proof of concept if nothing else.

Edited by Aeana

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Is this considered as tweaking the game or clinet? I'm afraid you made a public video may get you a trouble (if this is noticed by SQEN somehow).

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I'm not really concerned about that, personally. Companies tend not to go after translation efforts. Plus, it's not like Phantasy Star Online 2 doesn't have a very well-publicized client translation and it's still going.

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I made a short video demonstrating the progress I made tonight. Please keep in mind that these translations were extremely quick and dirty and not at all final!

 

 

Long ways to go, but a nice proof of concept if nothing else.

 

Aeana if your gonna be handling a translation project, have you gotten, or considered, getting a team of fans with specific skills you need to help you?  From the way it sounds, it seems theirs alot of garbage data and wasted space ya can use to give you the bytes needed to change everything you want to translate into English font. 

 

And yes you are right.  PSO2 has a somewhat large team of translators who flat out knew that SEGA would never release PSO2 to us, and even if they did, SEGA will probably think they can screw us on content updates again like they did with PSO and PSU.  Its one of the reasons why SEGA is having a really difficult time getting the game to us, because they know they cant screw us over again, thus, making much less money.  They would have to actually put in an effort to give us content almost 1:1 to what the Japanese playerbase gives, or else no one will leave the Japanese servers to play on the English servers due to the constant ongoing fan-translation that pretty much translates 70-90 percent of everything on the Japanese client.  Infact flat out, SEGA knows if they tried to screw us again, they would be giving an additional and very large resource, the English client, for the Translators to use to help translate the Japanese version.  

 

But what really sparked it for PSO2 though?  When the PSO2 closed beta for Japan happened, it was supposed to be a closed beta for world-wide, it had English, German, French and Spanish all ready to go.  But they never did it for anyone but Japan.  Thats what got the Fan-translators started.  

 

Now, thankfully with DQX, you dont have Story dialogue and most NPCs changing what they say every 4-6 weeks like it seems with PSO2, its why they been having a hard time doing more than a 90 percent translation, they are always in the ballpark of 50-90 percent but usually around 60 depending.  So whatever you translate, create, inject, update and patch, should permanently translate whatever it is you did.  

 

But im sure you know it would be a serious undertaking, but if ya get a team to do this, and honestly, if SE knows about it and finds out about it, they wont, shouldn't, do anything negative, but possibly the opposite, they may actually take western considerations more seriously.  

 

I am thirty years old now, honestly I cant really handle, playing super hard-core to be the best of the best anymore like I did in many MMOs and the latest being FFXIV.  After that FC betrayal I pretty much am just tired. DQX is the kinda retirement MMO I need.  No competition, no b.s, no griefing.  Its slow paced too, everything I could want.  I honestly wish I had any sort of programming skills to help you with, but I dont.  Honestly if I was a rich man id donate to you alot of money and help you that way. But all I can give now is suggestions.

 

If your planning for the long term, I suggest starting with beginning stuff.  Compartmentalize each thing and commit progress to each one until it is done. Keep it neat and organized, but also, have fun with it and vary it, so you or any of your helpers dont go insane.   Thats usually what happens to alot of fan-translators, they put too much work and time into it, and eventually burn themselves out, because they are not having fun.  

 

Menu Screens: 80%

Items/Equipment: 40%

Offline Story: 15%

Ogre Start Story: 30%

Weddie Start Story: 20%

Elf Start Story: 40%

Dwarf Start Story: 10%

Puri? Start Story: 20%

Starter Town NPC Dialogues: 5%

Ogre Glen City Dialogues: 10%

Random Quest Dialogues: 15%

 

Etc.  Thankfully anything you do will be permanent since I doubt, SE is gonna drastically change any of the quests, npc dialogues, and what not as more content comes out.  The only problematic one is those timed quests and scenarios they put out for a limited time.  They seem to be treating it like FFXI concerning content.  But I am sure you know how to organize things and such.  Just remember, if your gonna undertake this, and ya done enough work but feel like you cant do it anymore, make sure to leave all you done to another group of translators that will continue the project.  

Edited by Alexandrious

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Well, I'm open to any assistance people are willing to give me. Once I get more of the text sectors dumped, I can post them and ask for translation help. I can do it myself, but it'll take much longer. I'd like to stress that this is only for menu text for now. Story text is a different beast entirely, although one I'd like to tackle someday (and would need a bunch of help for).

 

While I was working on the translations last night, I actually discovered that in some cases, the game stops drawing a string past a certain length, despite it fitting in memory, which is kind of frustrating. That's a problem I don't know how to solve, so I'm certainly open to anybody with the knowledge to fix that helping out as well.

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I would just say abbreviate as needed for the short fix, it is still going to be easier (at least for me) to remember something like Sts is short for Statistics rather than the Japanese text would be.

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Yeah. Abbreviations are so tacky, but I've used them where I have to. The game itself uses them in Japanese anyway, just in different places. Some stuff needs to be expanded, anyway. For instance, in Japanese, shield is a single character 盾 but I can't fit anything resembling shield in 3 characters (I get 3 characters because the game uses UTF8 encoding which uses 3 bytes for every Japanese character). Fortunately, I can steal some space from elsewhere without a problem. I don't think I'm going to have a major issue with memory storage like I thought, but on-screen limitations are going to rear their ugly heads. One I ran into already is that I can't fit "Battle command setup" in the titlebar of the battle command setup page, it cuts it off at "setu" So I need to fit something that resembles "battle command setup" in 19 characters.

Edited by Aeana

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Yeah. Abbreviations are so tacky, but I've used them where I have to. The game itself uses them in Japanese anyway, just in different places. Some stuff needs to be expanded, anyway. For instance, in Japanese, shield is a single character 盾 but I can't fit anything resembling shield in 3 characters (I get 3 characters because the game uses UTF8 encoding which uses 3 bytes for every Japanese character). Fortunately, I can steal some space from elsewhere without a problem. I don't think I'm going to have a major issue with memory storage like I thought, but on-screen limitations are going to rear their ugly heads. One I ran into already is that I can't fit "Battle command setup" in the titlebar of the battle command setup page, it cuts it off at "setu" So I need to fit something that resembles "battle command setup" in 19 characters.

 

3 Characters? Can Abv that too, SLD. SHD. That can work for Shield. Battle Command Setup?  B.Command. Does it have to be 19 characters or can it be less?  B.Command Setup? BTL. Command Setup? Can you use empty spaces to fill it out if it has to be 19 perfectly?

Edited by Alexandrious

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If you know DOS, then Battle Cmd Setup ;)

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Yeah I thought of those. They just give me Breath of Fire 1 flashbacks.

 

Bof-coach.png

 

But I'll have to give up on aesthetics in some cases. :(

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Yeah I thought of those. They just give me Breath of Fire 1 flashbacks.

 

Bof-coach.png

 

But I'll have to give up on aesthetics in some cases. :(

 

Personally you can use all the Abvs, short words, and such you want until you can find someone who is able to do what your having trouble with. Any english translation long as it makes some sense, id be fine with though thats just me. 

Edited by Alexandrious

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Interesting bit about the "Fish" command. You never see anybody really talking about it or using it. Nobody really knows why it's in the game. You select the command and some guy pops up and tells you that the game sucks. Weird.

 

See?

 

oV3L8R5.jpg

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Yeah. Abbreviations are so tacky, but I've used them where I have to. The game itself uses them in Japanese anyway, just in different places. Some stuff needs to be expanded, anyway. For instance, in Japanese, shield is a single character 盾 but I can't fit anything resembling shield in 3 characters (I get 3 characters because the game uses UTF8 encoding which uses 3 bytes for every Japanese character). Fortunately, I can steal some space from elsewhere without a problem. I don't think I'm going to have a major issue with memory storage like I thought, but on-screen limitations are going to rear their ugly heads. One I ran into already is that I can't fit "Battle command setup" in the titlebar of the battle command setup page, it cuts it off at "setu" So I need to fit something that resembles "battle command setup" in 19 characters.

Battle Command Setup -> Battle Orders or Battle Tactics, or even just Orders, is how I would shorten that one.

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